Tuesday, February 20, 2007

Kangen Water - Myths and Facts

Recently there has been a lot of talk about the unique and health-giving benefits of Kangen water. This interest in Kangen water coincided with the push into the alkaline water market by the MLM (Multi Level Marketing) company Enagic.

This article is written with the intention to address some of what is been said on other web sites and in public meetings, so that customers wanting the best value for their money, are able to make an informed opinion about "Kangen water" without the hype.

Myth One: Kangen water is different from alkaline, ionized water.

Fact: The word "Kangen" in Japanese means "return to origin" and is simply a marketing term. The Enagic water ionizer contains a filter and ionizing chamber just like all other alkaline water ionizers. Also Enagic ionizers create the same type of alkaline and acidic water as created by all other water ionizers.

The ionizing chamber in the Enagic uses the same technology as do all other water ionizers to split the water inro acid and alkaline streams. Kangen water is simply another name for ionized, alkaline water. Nowhere will you be able to find a definition of Kangen water that is different than alkaline water because there is not any.

In trying to make a difference where there is none, an Enagic representative's web site says, "technically, in order to be classified as Kangen Water, it needs to show a negative ORP in the range of -200mV to -450mV, while typical Ionized Alkaline Water shows anywhere between +100mV and -100mV, depending on the quality of the machine". Even cheap copy ionizers from China can get at least a -250mV ORP reading and Jupiter ionizers can get over -800mV.That been said, Enagic through its MLM is doing a fantastic job of introducing the concept of alkaline and acid (kangen) water to people who would otherwise not know about it.

Myth Two: Kangen water is better than alkaline, ionized water.

Fact: There are two ways the quality of kangen or alkaline water are measured - by how acid or alkaline the water becomes (pH) and by how much ionization occurs (ORP).

Independent tests carried out by ex-Enagic representatives (concerned about the high prices been charged), showed that the Jupiter Science Melody produced as high an ORP (negative ionization) as did the tested Enagic model and when salt was added to the calcium port produced a stronger acidic water than that achieved by the Enagic.

Unfortunately when there are very high prices there is also a need to justify the difference - hence the hype such as in the following from an Enagic distributor:

"This water technology is practically non-existent outside Japan. ... Even worse, there are some people who are trying to sell cheaper Ionized Alkaline Water machines as if they were at the same or a similar level as with the Kangen Water machines, only cheaper."

Myth Three: Enagic units and kangen water are recognised and approved by the Japanese Health Department, unlike other ionizers.

Fact: In the 1980s the Japanese Health Department recognized that ionized alkaline water (kangen water) from water ionizers had proven health benefits and described water ionizers as health devices. Nowhere did any Government say specifically that Enagic units were the ones approved.

Below are examples of comments from an Enagic web site and ones that are often voiced."The Enagic is approved by The Japan Ministry of Health, as a top quality medical device" or "Enagic units and kangen water are recognised and approved by the Japanese Health
Department".

Major corporations in Japan such as Hyundai, LG and Samsung use standard Jupiter Science parts to manufacture their own ionizers and all have approval from the Japan Ministry of Health.

Myth Four: Well known authorities on ionized water endorse or recommend Enagic ionizers.

Fact: The best known authorities in the USA such as Dr. Robert Young (author of The pH Miracle), Dr. Theodore Baroody (author of Alkalize or Die), and Sang Whang (author of Reverse Aging) all recommend and sell Jupiter Science water ionizers because they want to give their customers high quality kangen or alkaline water ionizers at an honest price. Other well know alkaline authorites that endorse and use Jupiter Science water ionzers include Daniel Reed (author of The Tao of Detox), Harald Tietze (author of Youthing) and Ian Hamilton (author of The Untold Truth...).

If Enagic is such an old established, reputable company offering technology that is so much better than what other ionizer companies can offer for much less - then where are their credable spokepersons?

Myth Five: Kangen or Enagic ionizers cost more because they are better.

The Jupiter Melody is priced at around $1000 and offers some important user friendly features that are missing with the Enagic. Certain alkaline water ionizers are better and stronger than others and the Enagic range are decent models, but when you have a MLM company that pays eight levels down you have to create an artificially high price because Enagic and up to eight representatives need to make money from every single sale.

Enagic products are sold by MLM "reps" who typically do not have a thorough technical understanding of the properties of water, ionization and how the two together produce health benefits. There are exceptions; reps who have really rolled up their sleeves and educated themselves, but the fact remains that there is a lot of "bogus" information fed to people who have been to Enagic presentations. Going to a few MLM presentations does not make one an expert in something, especially something as complex and technical as ionization. Enagic "reps" are often innocently fed misinformation and led to believe in half truths. Then these misinformed "reps", who are motivated by the MLM dream, go forth and perpetrate these inaccuracies and mislead naïve customers into falsely thinking they are getting something of good value. The price of Enagic models has more to do with compensating the Enagic MLM reps than the actual cost or the comparative technology inherent in their ionizers. To verify that, simply ask Enagic about their compensation plan and see how much money is paid to the various levels of the network organization when one machine is sold.

Myth Six:Enagic has been marketing "Kangen Water" for 30 years.Fact:What became the Enagic brand was initially manufactured by Toyo Metal a/k/a Toyo Aitex who recently sold marketing rights to Enagic (also called the Thohan Kiden organization). Toyo Metal water ionizer were called the Apex, Pure Porte 11 or Protec units and these early models were manufactured by and sold for less much less than $1000 in the USA.

A company called HydroAnalytics previously imported, distributed and did hands-on repairs on this unit from Japan for the US, Western Hemisphere and European market before it was wuithdrawn from the US market, presumably due to lack of market penetration. In Japan the Thohan Kiden organization manufactures units, that are not sold through the Enagic MLM, for similar prices to other alkaline water ionizer in the US market.

Here are some bullet points to consider in comparing Enagic to Jupiter:

Filtration: Jupiter's Biostone filtration system is available in 1 micron and .01 micron levels of filtration. Both options have coral calcium and tourmaline to improve performance (Enagic does not have a .01 Biostone or the Calcium or Tourmaline).

Installation: the Melody can be installed three ways including undersink, unlike the Enagic.

Functionality: the Melody has increased functionality in terms of a flow control valve that operates independently of the tap (Enagic is only controlled by tap). Jipiter's two latest models (better quality than the Melody) have a fully automatic valve system. The more advanced
Jupiter models also have an LCD control panel screen which has various readouts and alarms.

Cleaning: the Melody, and the two latest models have a patented reversible chamber so you can ALWAYS get alkaline or kangen water even while the machine is cleaning (with Enagic you have to wait).

Performance: the Melody in side by side comparisons is at least equal to the Enagic Levelluk DX II.

Jupiter's latest two models the Aquarius and Orion, being stronger than the Melody, will most likely outperform Enagic (not tested yet against Enagic).

Cutting Edge Technology: Jupiter's latest models have new patented features to further distinguish them in value. Features like:

1) the new mesh plating (increases surface area of electrode creating a stronger kangen water). This means that Jupiter is able to achieve a higher ORP and pH output within having to increase the size of the plates. Larger and more plates means more electricity and more wear.

2) a new patented SOL automatic valve system to optimize ORP at lower levels of pH (Enagic doesn't have a valve other than the tap!)

3) the new patented DARC cleaning system which eliminates mineral deposits ensuring more power and longer plate life.

Manufacturing Standards: Jupiter's parent company makes Medical Equipment and Jupiter has been manufacturing ionizers since 1982. Who owns Enagic and what is their background?

Jupiter manufactures in a state of the art ISO 9001 certified and ionizer-dedicated plant (they do not make anything else). ISO is the world-recognized certification for quality standards in manufacturing (see: www.iso.org). Certification is very expensive and time consuming. Jupiter products are additionally CE, UL and RoK2 certified.

Reliability: Jupiter has the lowest return rate for service in the industry (less than 2%). When something does need repair, we have repair facilities on both coasts ensuring prompt service.
Good Looks: Jupiter machines (particularly the latest models) are sophisticated, stylish and contemporary looking.

Support: All units come with a half hour DVD that shows how to install and get the best kangen or alklaine water out of your ionizer. Professional, trained staff are available to answer any questions.

Value: When you buy from Jupiter Science (IonLife) you buy top quality at an honest, retail price.

60 comments:

james99 said...

In the UK/EU Jupiter Water Ionizers are available from:
http://glowing-health.com

Balanced said...

It is with great respect that I view your report, but when gathering facts, it is important to have a balanced perspective. For one I note that you use your professional voice to take a sided perspective. Meaning you are promoting the product while giving a professional view about an industry (MLM) and the competitors product. When this type of argument is made, especially when given by someone using their professional title, it is called 'winged' a term politicians use to promote an agenda. It is true of any industry to have 'hype' and 'myth' as you certainly can attest to in the medical or pharmaceutical field being a doctor. That being said your comments are most appreciated that are directed towards comparison of price and value. I would caution though, if you are going to critique an entire industry from your position and status, that you mention at least some benefits to be balanced....

Chris Varvaro said...

Thanks For The Great Information. Good Luck!

regina said...

have ANY of these Ionized Alakaline Water Machines been reviewed/critiqued by a Consumer Based Organisation? If so, does anyone have the link? So far, I've only been able to find information by SELLER'S of the Machines......not by an unbiased organization.
Thank you.

doc hight said...

Can you tell me anything about these machines, "Enagic or Jupiter" and their effect on the bond angle of the hydrogen bond in water. I am interested in comparing some of the statements or claims made by John Ellis and his water machine.

I am also interested to know if you have had any feedback on your book "The PH Miracle" from the father of Jayne Clayson who wrote the foreward to your book? Dr. Karl Clayson is a well known vascular surgeon in northern California.

Carlos said...

Jupiter or Enagic??? It is about money or health???

KANGEN WEBSITE said...

Dear Kangen Distributor,

I just wanted to let you know we have a really spectacular Kangen Website that we are offering to all Kangen Distributors. It runs $19.95 per/mo, and it mirrors all of our marketing materials including DVD's, Business Cards, Etc. This is the very Best Marketing Tool for all of your MLM distributors getting the word out and simplifying their demonstrations, therefore increasing your sales. We have plenty of distributors and their downline signed up with our site, and its working wonderful for them. Please visit our links:

Our Main Website:
www.KangenWholesale.com

Marketing Tools:
(Please look at all the marketing tools we offer to all your distributors. These tools are all personalized to each website subscribers personal information)
www.KangenWholesale.com/members

Please let me know what you think.

Ari Lee

vegaswaterman said...

Let me see now. I can buy a Jupiter machine and get a 3 year warranty and not make any money for referring anyone else to it. Or, for a business investment, I can make good money off of people that I have never talked to. Which would I rather do? Not to mention the 139 business expenses I use on my Schedule C that I would not get if I spent one way money and got a Jupiter machine. Which one truly is the better deal???

My health has improved greatly in the three weeks I have been using the Kangen machine. I expect my finances to follow as I see checks for over $5,000 per month.

HealthyWealthynWise said...

Very interesting.
Is this a paid representative for Jupiter is using his academic credentials to put down Kangen water? If the other product being endorsed was so good, why would you have to come after Kangen water specifically?
While MLM's can have their issues, however Kangen is medical and hospital-grade quality which means they last forever in hospital settings, as they were originally used in Japan and continued to be used, because of this. Kangen water uses platinum-coated plates to create the high ORP ratings (-900) that are essential to the best water possible. I have been told many other ionizers either do not get above -300 ORP or they (including Jupiter) are using tourmaline to create these ORP ratings, leaving the body with metals that can not be processed and are not good for the body. So what is the sense? I can say first-hand that EVERYONE that I know who is using the Kangen water, is amazed at how they feel and the changes taking place within days and weeks. In this marketplace, you will always get what you pay for. Think about it.

Tinapunan said...

Anyone who would like to read a neutral view about "kangen"/ionized/alkaline water, read the article of Mr. Stephen Lower, a retired faculty member of the Dept. of Chemistry of Simon Fraser University, titled "Ionized" and alkaline water Snake oil on tap. I know that I saved few thousand dollars by reading this article. Inform me of your reaction.

vegaswaterman said...

Yep, real snake oil. I've lost over 30 pounds in 3 months and my arthritis is all but gone. The real testimonial comes from a lady that bought a machine from me because it gave her life back to her after she suffered a stroke 7 years ago. Traditional medicine couldn't do for her in 7 years what the water did for her in one month. So, save your thousands of dollars. You will need it to pay for the heart attack or stroke you may have down the road.

Neutral7 said...

I have had many friends and family use the Kangen water and have had their arthritis vanish, gout go away, cysts shrink, etc... Not to mention the vast energy I and everyone I know have recieved. I know of one person that got a Jupiter and it didn't work, so they had to send in for another and felt not much from it. Then someone gave them Kangen water and they felt energy and bought one. So who knows?? All I can say is what I have seen and felt!

Houston091007 said...

I consider myself partial. I am an engineer by profession, matured and been around the world a few times. I had been involved with projects utilizing treated, deionized and desalinated water in design, installation and operation. I have concentrated on alkaline ionized water research to help my wife helping aged people with medical problems since both of us have similar age-related illnesses. She has not made money yet and she is finding out that most people are skeptical particularly when it comes to health issue. Most don't want to spend the money on something like this but rather spend foolishly on cellphones, jewelries, etc. To me, it appears that alkaline ionized water is helping my wife's condition but it's too early to tell. Why lot's of people are ganging on Enagic, it's because it is biggest name and it's a natural process. Robert Young is endorsing Jupiter. Stephen Lower a retired chemist who made money teaching but never invented anything to help manking and now bad-mouthing alkaline ionizers. The japenese are foremost in alkaline water ionizer that was invented for agricultural purposes who later found out that human being can benefit, too. The koreans adopted the technology and is widely used for medical treatment. Lot's of positive testimonials to ignore benefits of owning one since the anti-oxidant property diminishes rapidly with time so it got to be taken by mouth as soon as it comes out of the machine. I've proved it with pH and ORP testers.

health said...

Thank you for sharing your views. As a research scientist, you seem to have a tremendous background and knowledge in the field of ionizied, alkaline water. I am neutral since I haven't yet purchased any Water Ionizers. My background is business, and I realize in business, you have to promote the company that pays you. So I understand that you write this blog with good intention, in promoting your brand. It would be good, though, if you were to do it without any negativity to any one company. That is when competition gets bad. Keep competition good! Keep it a win win! When sales escalate in any one company, other brands tend to "go after" that company, hence your comparisons with Enagic. I have known people who had other brands, just to switch to Enagic's brand. Yes, it is a little pricey, but you really get what you pay for. Again, I am neutral as I have not yet purchased any one. Also, I looked at Enagic's compensation to their distributors and it appears to me that this company is designed for you to share what's working for you, and when you do, you get a referral check. It reminds me of that movie "Pay it Forward." You help a few, who then goes and helps a few, and so forth and so on, because the distributors seem to give their enrollments away! I have never ever seen that in any one company! It's about "Paying it Forward" and helping each and every person out there! Good Health to Everyone!

World said...
This post has been removed by the author.
World said...

Kangen Water Tech - Facts Only

The author mentioned “HydroAnalytics”, the original importer of Kangen water technology. I tracked them down at: http://home.earthlink.net/~microwater/hydroanalytics
or
http://www.hydroanalytics.com

HydroAnalytics agreed that ionized water can be produced through different units adding that component quality also counts. A Hyundai can get you from Point A to Point B the same as a Lexus but there’s a big difference between cars. That made sense. From extensive browsing, I gather that Japanese technology is superior to Korean technology. The IE-500 sold by HydroAnalytics is not MLM and sells for $2,5000 in Asia and for a lot less in the USA. The Jupiters sells for less than half price in Asia but do not give a real reduction in the USA because they are cheaper models. The author zppears self-serving and obviously a Jupiter salesman. Am I wrong? From my research, the Japanese units are much higher quality. The units sold by HydroAnalytics are made by the same engineering that make the Kangen water units. I had a Jupiter for some years. I recently bought the IE-500. My family is happy with the quality. HydroAnalytics also said that only they and the Kangen water company make the residential super-acid units. The Koreans do not offer that. Take a good look around and compare before buying. My vote is with superior Japanese technology at the right price.

Richard Schneider

The Yeshe said...

"Kangen water" lives! You're right. Hydroanaltytics sold the "Kangen water" units in the US before Toyo Metal and Enagic went into MLM.
Hydroanalytics sells "identical "Kangen water" units made by the same Japanese group in Osaka, Japan that made the original Enagic units! Thanks for the tip. I got the IE-500 unit at less than 50% pf the non-MLM price in Asia. Hydroanalytics has the Kangen water units without the MLM price. Thank you!!!

ColinT

Water said...

Hello,

I noticed that your web site portrays a passion for the pursuit to establish a governmental system, whereby water is regulated differently and more efficiently and effectively.

I am wondering if you have done any research on Kangen Water (Ionized Water). I understand that this water is molecularly changed through a process of electrolysis. And.... that the process also changes the PH value of the water and then serves as an anti-oxyident for the body. After processing.... the water apparently has a negative "Oxygen Producing Potential" (ORP) of about -350, and it is said that when this water is comsumed that it hydrates the tissues of our body more effectively because of the converted molecular structure? (And consequently becomes a de-aging method when consumed)

The devices that one would purchase to convert this water have settings which you can set to produce water with different PH levels. My question is....the PH value can be changed by adding Baking Soda so shouldn't the method of converting have device settings whereby one would meausre the new molecular structure??.... as ....that seems to be the most important factor affecting our health and of reversing the aging factor.

Please let me know what your thoughts are around this type of water conversion and the possible health benefits of drinking/cooking/bathing in.. this ionized water? Apparently Japan and China have implemented this type of conversion in many of their homes and hospitals. And..... consider this ionzation process as a registered medical treatment.

If you believe in this type of conversion process of water please advice if you know of any preferred manufacturers. One of my concerns is that.... the devices are just showing the PH value after conversion and that isn't where the actual benefits are coming from if I am understanding the process correctly?

Lorna McPherson

Water said...

Hello,

I noticed that your web site portrays a passion for the pursuit to establish a governmental system, whereby water is regulated differently and more efficiently and effectively.

I am wondering if you have done any research on Kangen Water (Ionized Water). I understand that this water is molecularly changed through a process of electrolysis. And.... that the process also changes the PH value of the water and then serves as an anti-oxyident for the body. After processing.... the water apparently has a negative "Oxygen Producing Potential" (ORP) of about -350, and it is said that when this water is comsumed that it hydrates the tissues of our body more effectively because of the converted molecular structure? (And consequently becomes a de-aging method when consumed)

The devices that one would purchase to convert this water have settings which you can set to produce water with different PH levels. My question is....the PH value can be changed by adding Baking Soda so shouldn't the method of converting have device settings whereby one would meausre the new molecular structure??.... as ....that seems to be the most important factor affecting our health and of reversing the aging factor.

Please let me know what your thoughts are around this type of water conversion and the possible health benefits of drinking/cooking/bathing in.. this ionized water? Apparently Japan and China have implemented this type of conversion in many of their homes and hospitals. And..... consider this ionzation process as a registered medical treatment.

If you believe in this type of conversion process of water please advice if you know of any preferred manufacturers. One of my concerns is that.... the devices are just showing the PH value after conversion and that isn't where the actual benefits are coming from if I am understanding the process correctly?

Lorna McPherson

Roberto A said...

www.hydroanlytics.com not much help.

I havent bought enagic but been taking Kangen water produced from enagic for 1 month now. It has cured me of my kidney infection and the cysts has become smaller. I wanted to buy enagic but found the price too expensive so this brought me to your site and other sites as well.

However, I do not appreciate your trashing style to promote your product. Since I've tried kangen water from enagic machine, I would probably buy one soon.

From the Philippines

Sildem said...

One datum was left out of all the comments I read. After a couple of days the negative ORP property of the water is gone. Until now no one has been able to stably maintain the negative ionization of the water. It was not able to be bottled. Now you can get bottled negatively ionized water. No need to buy an expensive machine. Go to drinkrealwater.com for more information. We have 500ml bottles available guaranteed orp of -50 (usually around -120)and a concentrate with an orp of around -400. You can add that to ordinary bottled water and voila! you have alkalyzed and negatively ionized water. The more you add, the stronger it gets.

Water said...

And....What happens to the water when it hits our stomach acid ???

kymor said...

If this water produces all the benefits that the company claims, why can't it be sold in the stores?

Sherry said...

I respect your research in the area of microbiology and nutrition. I think you have done a marvelous job in establishing the fact that our health is greatly influenced by the ph of our diets, including the water we drink.

After hearing hundreds of fabulous success stories from a physician about his experience with the Enagic machine and the Kangen water it produces, it has convinced me that your ph theories are correct.

This physician has owned both a Jupiter and an Enagic machine and has had many more good health benefits produced from the Enagic machine than the Jupiter.

That's the clincher. Which water is giving people the best results and it is the Enagic machine that is producing the best results.

I have personally witnessed a very good friend get feeling back in his previously numb feet (from diabetes) and had his failing vision improve from drinking this water. Every person I know that is drinking this water is having good health results.

Thank you for teaching us that alkalized and ionized water really is a great thing for us.

Find out how at: www.beatsbottledwater.com

Sherry said...

I respect your research in the area of microbiology and nutrition. I think you have done a marvelous job in establishing the fact that our health is greatly influenced by the ph of our diets, including the water we drink.

After hearing hundreds of fabulous success stories from a physician about his experience with the Enagic machine and the Kangen water it produces, it has convinced me that your ph theories are correct.

This physician has owned both a Jupiter and an Enagic machine and has had many more good health benefits produced from the Enagic machine than the Jupiter.

That's the clincher. Which water is giving people the best results and it is the Enagic machine that is producing the best results.

I have personally witnessed a very good friend get feeling back in his previously numb feet (from diabetes) and had his failing vision improve from drinking this water. Every person I know that is drinking this water is having good health results.

Thank you for teaching us that alkalized and ionized water really is a great thing for us.

Find out how at: beatsbottledwater.com

Hydro said...

We recently responded to Dr. Andrew Weil’s comments on Ionized Alkaline water and wish to share them with anyone who is interested in this topic.
http://home.earthlink.net/~microwater/hydroanalytics/id15.html

All Best Wishes,
Stanley Arcieri
for HydroAnalytics

Hydro said...

Stephen Lower is, in a word, wrong. He incorrectly states that it is not possible for
water top have a high negative or high positive charge. HydroAnalytics will pay anyone $10,000 if the following is incorrect: Water form your tap has a positive charge. Most supermarkets sell DE-IONIZED water. I put this in caps to emphasize the obvious. Water is de-ionized because it already has an ionic charge in it. De-ionized water means that the ions have been reduced to zero. Does Stephen Lower also think that de-ionized water sold in thousands of stores is unreal? If so, he is missing some basic facts. De-ionized water is well-established in science and is simply about removing the ions in water that Stephen thinks do not exist. Does he think there is such a thing as “de-ionized” water but no such thing as water with ions in it? Here is a link on de-ionized water
http://infao5501.ag5.mpi-sb.mpg.de:8080/topx/archive?link=Wikipedia-Lip6-2/2062611.xml&style

Ionized acid water with a pH of 2.5 can easily have a positive charge of over +1000 Mv (millivolts). Ionized alkaline water with a pH of 9.0 can easily have a negative charge of over -200 mV. We have additionally responded to Dr. Andrew Weil’s inaccurate comments at our site. Here’s the link from the HydroAnalytics site: http://home.earthlink.net/~microwater/hydroanalytics/id15.html

Brian said...

The Jupiter and Enagic machines are dissassembled and compared here:
http://onetoanother.com/pubfunc/CSD/compare_comp;jsessionid=34BA3CB2D3B18A684789806C1597CCB1
It takes a minute to load, but shows clearly the Jupiter is no way the same as Enagic's. This video persuaded me to get the Enagic SD501 and in 24 hours I cleared up chronic eye strain (bloodshot eyes) that had bothered me for 20 years. People remark now my eyes are white for the first time in years.

Brian said...

It's a long URL so I'll break it in two. Cut and paste into your browser:

http://onetoanother.com/pubfunc/CSD/compare_comp;

jsessionid=34BA3CB2D3B18A684789806C1597CCB1

Brian said...

This "Myths and Facts" article by a Jupiter distributor is reproduced in 100's of sites on the internet promoting Jupiter. But just read the comments here, and the comments and you'll see that Kangen Water produced by Enagic's machines have produced very spectacular results and testimonials that make Jupiter pale by comparison. For a rather long audio review by Dr Dave Carpenter, ND see:
http://www.criesforwater.com/
Kangen_Myths_&_Facts.html
He says here he bought a Jupiter recommended to him by Dr Young. He says he wasted his money and bought the Enagic SD501 as it is far superior in terms of the most important thing... the results on our health. Dr Carpenter has bought and tested 8 or 10 different models and find the Enagic SD501 to by far be the best. A short summary of his comments here:
http://www.energistx.com/water/kangenwater.html

degauss said...

I've done a load of looking into various ionizers and ran across an interesting site. There is no doubt the Enagic machine is superior to the various Jupiter models. However, there are 2 machines that out perform the Enagic. Check out this site.

http://www.ionizersreviewed.com/

Katherine said...

Degauss, thanks for the tip on the ionizersreviewed.com website! It was very informative and introduces a new model that's more reasonably priced, with higher Ph and ORC levels. Very helpful!

Melinda said...

I first heard of this water about 3 months ago and just rolled my eyes and politely listening to my friends story. Then he said his father was about to lose his toes due to diabetes and soaked his feet for one week in the 2.5 ph and the feet were well. (He had someone give him the water just to try). My aunt has AS and a side effect is oozing, pussing blisters on her feet and hands. I could not stand to look at them they looked so painful. I ran to this person to get this water (FOR $1 per gallon) for my aunt to try. After 3 days she called me. YOU WOULD NOT BELIEVE YOUR EYES! After three months, I have bought a machine. I was buying the water for $1 a gallon. 2.5 ph for my aunt. We started drinking the 8.5, then 9.0 and 9.5. Myself, mother, grandmother do not have constipation problems any more. Anothter aunt has seen her blood sugar drop. The aunt with AS - THREE doctors can't believe their eyes. THIS IS ONLY WHAT WE ARE SEEING. WHAT ABOUT WHAT WE DON'T SEE! BUY A MACHINE. I FINALLY DID. ENAGIC.

Healthychoice said...

What Yweshe says is correct. I know because I bought a Kangen ionizers in the USA before they were sold in the Enagic MLM. My price was less than $1000 for the same ionizer now sold for about $4000.
Toyo sells "identical "Kangen water" units made by the same Japanese group in Osaka, Japan that made the original Enagic units.
However even at lower price I think there are a couple of brands in USA that are better value. My ionizer was ok but Enagic models still use old technology that only cleans after so many liters (making the plates less efficient after about 1 year). My new prefered brand keeps the plates clean all the time plus uses more advanced smaller plating that require less wattage. It does pay to check around!

Ben said...
This post has been removed by the author.
Ben said...

Great article debunking the myths of kangen water: http://kangen-water-scam.blogspot.com

A lot of interesting points from the author of that article - Kangen machines definitely seem overpriced compared to the machine listed there.

CYTOTECH said...

to healthy choice- which ionizers do you recommend?

sildem said...

Update:
Since my last post I have found out that ORP meters need to be treated to get the best readings of ORP. You can make a treatment solution yourself. The first solution I made with diluted sulfuric acid. I made it from new battery acid with a specific gravity of 1250. Dilute that 10:1 with distilled water. soak your probe in that for one minute, then clean the probe off with running water or a volume of water so as not to contaminate your next solution. Then soak your probe in a 10:1 solution of common household bleach. Rinse and repeat. Your ORP meter will now read much better on both negative and positive ORP. In my prior post the ORP of the water we make was reading -125 on the bottled water and -400 on the concentrate. We now get -325 on the bottled water and -600 on the concentrate. pH on the bottled water is between 8 and 9 and over 11 on the concentrate.

If you want to try ionized alkaline water that does NOT have heavy metals from tourmaline or calcium from coral calcium (some medications are neutralized by the calcium added by other machines) try Real Water. (Http://www.drinkrealwater.com) All ionized water from other sources goes dead in a day or two so cannot be bottled and keep their ionization. Bottlers that say they can are lying. AHT does not keep its ionization. OURS DOES. You do not need to spend thousands to find out if it will work for you. You can buy it online or at many health stores like Whole Foods, J&J health foods etc. See our web site for a full list.

vetmed said...

No one answered the question about the affect of gastric acid on the water and how it gets into the system. My question is: what and where is the physiologic affect.

Truth Seeker said...

The reason noone will approach the question of what happens when any water travels down the esophagus and into the holding tank secreting Hydrochloric Acid and enzymes we call the stomach is that they don't want any part of reality to intrude on their marketing hype party.

I loved the post where "Hydro" relates his "understanding" of ionization and Deionized water! I almost fell off of my seat laughing! Does he (or any of these people here) know what the term "ion" means? I'll give you a hint- it is an atom or molecule which has gained or lost a valence electron -giving it a positive or negative charge. Charge is a quality of protons and electrons. I know, this is rocket science and I've already blown your mind with this. I could just sum this up by saying what a load of tripe this whole concept is. The one good thing is that people are experiencing the benefits of both the Pygmalion effect and the placebo effect!

Water is a FANTASTIC solvent. Most tap water contains many different materials in solution (metals and salts). Deionized water simply has had many of the dissolved materials removed. If water was truly De-ionized, there would be no atoms/molecules with ANY net charge and the water would therefore be ... NEUTRAL (that's right Hydro). It is not "positive". Having illustrated the ignorance of one small claim (that bewrays a total lack of understanding of science and reality), should I continue on to expose the rest of this CRAP for what it is? Would anyone here actually be interested in honesty and truth? Probably not, because when they find out then they might feel bad about lying to people and realize they are stealing fools' money.

Back to what happens when you add a mild base (alkaline substance) to a STRONG acid (did you know that the pH scale is logarithmic?) there is a rapid reaction in which a neutralization occurs generally resulting in the production of a salt. Do you know how much pH8.5 solution it would take to neutralize the amount of stomach acid that you naturally produce in an hour?

Any supposed effect of "ionization" (let me guess, would you be trying to claim some change in the hydrogen bonding potential?) would INSTANTLY disappear as the water enters the stomach.

GROW UP PEOPLE! Go read a non-fiction book and try to LEARN something.

Your body is an amazing machine that actually regulated pH itself and you'd have to work hard to overwhelm internal mechanisms (lungs, kidneys, ion channels in the colon, etc...

If you REALLY want to experience alkalosis try hyperventilating for a period - respiratory alkalosis is FANTASTIC (sarcasm). Or, you can try to induce systemic alakalosis (but that takes a lot more work). Go ahead, do a real search on Systemic Alkalosis online...

Truth Seeker said...
This post has been removed by the author.
Jeff said...

Truth Seeker, I have read your post many times, and just cannot find where Hydro has made any claims that you have attacked him/her for. I only see where Hydro had made a distintion between De-Ionized water, and ionized water. Hydro does say that water from the tap has a positive charge, if you dispute this, ( which is unclear based on your comments/remarks) then try to prove it scientifically and you'll be $10,000 dollars richer. I'd like to see you lose the condescending tone, and offer something of value, instead of snide remarks. The one thing in your post I would agree with is this, I too would like to see some scientific test results showing what becomes of ionized water after entering the acidic environment of the stomach, an excellent question that needs to be answered.

barry said...

These Machines Are Great For Home Use, But When Traveling They Are Difficult To Take With You. I Found The Solution A Little 4oz. Bottle of "Real Water Concentrate" You Can Take It Anywhere.

Real Water Concentrate has a stabilized negative (-) Oxidation Reduction Potential (ORP) through a proprietary process called the Electron Energized or E2 technology. Our concentrate does not have any chemicals added to maintain a proper pH as many other products do to achieve alkalized water.

Real Water Concentrate adds a negative charge to your water making it more bio-available. A side benefit is the proper pH due to your water now having the correct amount of electrons. Thus you can use E2 Stabilized Real Water Concentrate to change your water's foundation and enjoy the many benefits.

Check Out This Product At: http://www.therealwaterclub.info/powerline

John said...

I must say that the word has to be spread, and if Enagic costs more, at least we are spreading the word. I was not aware of this technology until an Enagic rep told me about it. So think of the extra cost as a way of compensating these great "health missionaries" that are teaching people more than the others out there.

Sandra said...

This is nothing more than modern snake oil, and anyone buying into it is being ripped off. PERIOD.

Ralf said...

hello,
can somebody answer the question that "Water" is posting:
what happens to ionized water when it reaches the stomach? How can it keep its PH when it encounters the strong HCl content of our stomach? what happens at that level?
thanks very much
R

cjb said...

Ralf~

That completley depends on the user. What do YOU beleive will happen...

Mike said...

For an explanation of what happens when alkaline water interacts with stomach acid, I found this article:

http://www.snyderhealth.com/water_ionizers/
what_is_ph_and_orp.html

(combine URL onto one line)

The whole article is informative, but the part you're looking for begins a page or two down.

rickmissy23 said...

Hello my name is Melissa. I dont have one of the Enagic Water Machines. My mother gets the water from a close friend of hers. Here is just something simple. She last year was so bad off she was in a wheel chair sleeping all day and could not make it from a car to the front door without going in and laying down. I get a call from a friend she said she seen my mother (I live in Phoenix she is Washington) she says what ever she is doing she looks great has a wonderful attitude. I have not vistited my mother for fear of how bad she is. I went to visit her for the 1st time in a year, how my she looks way better her attitude on life is wonderful. All she is doing is drinking Kangen water, so if that can change a persons life then I am sold. When I went to visit my daughter who hates drinking water did nothing but consume water. I am not a believer in the MLM process I have been involved in many of them and not one has paid me back, but in saying that think about this.

If you are self-employeed, do you have anyone work for you are conducting an MLM you make money off your employee, take the big department stores you have a regular employee they have a boss who gets bonuses off sales then there boss makes bonuses off them MLM... My husband owns his own company he has an employee when she helps him he makes money, really life is an MLM.

The only thing I wish they could do diff is if someone really needed the help then reduce what you make off them, I know that is what we have done. Remeber pay it foward.

rickmissy23 said...

Hello my name is Melissa. I dont have one of the Enagic Water Machines. My mother gets the water from a close friend of hers. Here is just something simple. She last year was so bad off she was in a wheel chair sleeping all day and could not make it from a car to the front door without going in and laying down. I get a call from a friend she said she seen my mother (I live in Phoenix she is Washington) she says what ever she is doing she looks great has a wonderful attitude. I have not vistited my mother for fear of how bad she is. I went to visit her for the 1st time in a year, how my she looks way better her attitude on life is wonderful. All she is doing is drinking Kangen water, so if that can change a persons life then I am sold. When I went to visit my daughter who hates drinking water did nothing but consume water. I am not a believer in the MLM process I have been involved in many of them and not one has paid me back, but in saying that think about this.

If you are self-employeed, do you have anyone work for you are conducting an MLM you make money off your employee, take the big department stores you have a regular employee they have a boss who gets bonuses off sales then there boss makes bonuses off them MLM... My husband owns his own company he has an employee when she helps him he makes money, really life is an MLM.

The only thing I wish they could do diff is if someone really needed the help then reduce what you make off them, I know that is what we have done. Remeber pay it foward.

samuel said...

This is for honest seek of truth; after having read all of the-comments here now you need proof. If you would go to www.enagic.com and download the documents you'll see that the name " KANGEN WATER " is a brand name to only One company and only this One company has the Seal of the Goveronment of Japan and Ministry of Health.Please look at this site www.thewatertruth.com/cgailyardnow The jupiter and about #30 other water Ioniers are not 50% as powerful as the Enagis SD-501 and gie me a call Please:904 219 2652 Pastor "G"

Laser Toner Dave said...

Appreciate the article, but you are leaving out one most important piece of information - The plates used to make the ionized water. While most ionizers will make decent alkaline water, the Enagic machines use no cost-cutting in the most expensive part of the machine - the Platinum-Coated Titanium plates. Simply put, by using these plates (long lasting, does not get clogged as easily when compared to typical, cheaper "mesh" design), the machines will produce high alkaline water for longer periods of time without repair/internal cleaning.

The fact is that most of the US has pretty hard water, and the build up caused by hard water will clog up the mesh plates pretty quickly (when compared to plates) and pretty soon the machines won't be producing any significant alkaline water unless a repair person opens up the machine, the processing chamber, and perform some heavy duty cleaning.

Now, the question is, knowing that the Enagic machines are actually better built and uses more expensive components for good reasons, is it still worth the price? That's the right question to ask yourself.

alicia said...

Face the facts:
www.getvibranceandhealth.com

Mikey said...
This post has been removed by the author.
Mikey said...

Sorry about that.. let's try again after proofreading. :r


Surprised nobody posted this link, since it was easy enough to find in a few minutes of research and has apparently been around since at least 2007, and perhaps as early as 2002:
http://www.chem1.com/CQ/ionbunk.html

Who to believe... scientists or salesmen...?

Gardenia said...

Too bad a product has to come on with its advertising by immediately denigrating another product. That makes me sincerely doubt this product (Jupiter) because it obviously can't stand on its own merits.

Victor said...

Interesting the pros and cons. Even some of the links provided say all of the ionizers are pseudoscience. Then if it is pseudoscience why even test for PH or ORP or so called micro clustering.
Now that being said Jupiter and any other company who says that they have an approved Medical Device.
You need to produce your documentation.

Enjoy the Blog.

PS I get my Kangen Water for FREE!!!

I don't own a Machine yet.
And since its free may never own one.

Blake said...

http://glowing-health.com/science-and-myths/snake-oil-part2.html


There is a section on stomach acid and effect on alkaline water. Don't know how true this is but many have asked for something on the topic.

Stanley said...

MESH ELECTRODES ARE INFERIOR. Here's why: Flat platinum coated electrodes made by I&E from Hydroanaltytics ---
http://home.earthlink.net/~microwater/hydroanalytics/id13.html
and from Enagic ---
http://www.enagic.com/en/
--- last longer! Water must flow as evenly as possible over a flat plate. If not, there is uneven heat distribution. This unevenly wears down the plates prematurely. Mesh plates are all uneven. Thus, they all have uneven heat distribution. These are basic engineering facts. Mesh plates are cheaper but their uneven flow will literally cut down on their lifetime of use. So it is.

Matthew said...

Brain Dunning did a GREAT review of Kangen and other devices for ionizing water and goes over the health benefits in detail. It's a real eye opener. You can listen to the podcast episode "Kangen Water: Change Your Water, Change Your Life" where he covers it. He also posted the transcript of the episode.